Lore talk:Ta'agra

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What's this page for?[edit]

Lore:Ta'agra seems to be one of the main places that people are pointed when asking about the language, so it seems reasonable to have all known words here, even where a translation is not known, or is reasonably-guessed but uncertain. Many unknown words are already included with only links to where they are used, but no translation. This seems reasonable to me where no translation is available in the source, but for articles like the Burnt Scripture or Viti's Notes: Song of Binding it seems a strange choice: these appear to be deliberately written as Rosetta stone documents, and there are enough words that we have independent verification of, that we can typically be confident of the word order of the others. I added these definitions in, but where the word order could potentially be different, I've appended a '?'. DewiMorgan (talk) 21:05, 29 November 2024 (UTC)

Ta'agra project[edit]

I advocate including the words from and references to the Ta'agra Project's dictionary, their changelog, etc, as a secondary "unreliable" secondary source, akin to how we already handle secondary sources ("Jobasha Interview — Douglas Goodall" and "Ta'Agra Phrases and Expressions — Jobasha"). They worked from a primary source we don't have access to ("Some time ago, ZOS was kind enough to send us a thorough list of their Ta'agra terms."), so I feel we'd be foolish not to indirectly take advantage of that source. The site appears to have been somewhat neglected for years (dead Discord invite, 2021 last site update, 2019 last dictionary update, 2018 last Twitter/YouTube posts). If it's worked on again, then hopefully our work here may feed back into helping them. If not, then at least if that site dies, the information will be retained here. One of the things I've learned over the years is that spreading information is one of the best ways of preventing bitrot on the internet. I'm willing to do the copying work there, and likely shall if nobody objects. Can always roll back my changes if people object afterwards. DewiMorgan (talk) 21:05, 29 November 2024 (UTC)

No, it's a fan project. I would be very interested to see this internal document though. —⁠Legoless (talk) 21:17, 29 November 2024 (UTC)
I would want to see their claimed document, but I'm not willing to trust that they have a secret list of canon words that they are allowed to publish indirectly without more evidence. Beyond that, it's a fan project, it shouldn't be copied onto UESP. --AKB Talk Cont Mail 21:21, 29 November 2024 (UTC)
I agree with consensus, and so have changed my position. Since their website explicitly states they make stuff up, we can't trust them. If we can pester ZOS to release that document again, to us or (as they apparently did with Draconic) to the Imperial Library, that would work as a source, but otherwise, nope. Sad news, but it's right that we are rigorous! DewiMorgan (talk) 22:29, 29 November 2024 (UTC)

Unknown terms[edit]

I don't want to clutter the page with lengthy lists of where common-but-unknown terms are found, and what their context is. But at the same time, this feels like it'll be handy to piece some stuff together, so I'll stick it here for now. DewiMorgan (talk) 06:11, 2 December 2024 (UTC)

dad'na
"Dur dad'na![1];
"Bahlee dad'niit!"[1][2];
"Dad'na eska vijah."[1];
"Dad'na fifeh'rai!"[3];
"Rites of Jhaz-kham Dad'na"[4];
place name Passage of Dad'na Ghaten;
fajh'na
"Fajh'na."[1];
"Fajh'na tah!"[1];
"Hahl fajh'na!"[1];
radhi
"Ji'zho tsin'radhi!" (related to ritual of Ku-ji'zho?)[1];
the name of Dak'radhi;
radhin
do-radhin = "Strong-Warrior,"[5][6];
"Hiich radhin, tamiit!"[1];
"Tsin radhin vabazeri."[7];
fish name Radhin Zhab;
traj
"Traj miir'gendi ka'isii" = Take my hand and follow[8];
"Miir traj'zho! Such power!"[1];
traji
"traji venya" = "compels you"[9];
"Traji mii'ranjir rithantii"[8];
trajii
"Sird'tse hatenii, soz rai trajii L'esweyr vabei jezni a tenarr vuskna luvizzna."[10];
Trajii ba'vedik!"[1];
"Soz fif'rai trajii, sa'purahd."[1];
rajiit
Bebaj tsin'rajiit"[11][1];
tsin
together(?) And tsin'ra maybe "together'great" = "all"?;
"Tsin radhin vabazeri. We make each other stronger."[7];
"Ji'zho tsin'radhi!";[1]
"Bebaj tsin'rajiit"[12][1];
"Var tsin'ra."[1];
"atatami tsin'ra ahzirr eta morna"[8];
character name Tsin'roh;
Adding some contributions to the above list, those I have some degree of certainty about, so that they can be checked for their validity first before they become additions to the page proper. (Note: in some translations, the pronouns are in parentheses. The reason is that the respective words in Ta'agra aren't part of the original phrases, but they need to be added in the English version in order for the latter to make sense.) SubtleWizart (talk) 22:56, 29 December 2024 (UTC)
dad'na: very likely a shortened/archaic version of sallidadna (= death), so it should be safe(ish) to translate it into death as well. In some cases, due to context, it may also mean dead or die.
"Dur dad'na!"
dur= give (durrarriss - give freely to the people) + dad'na= death
"Give (them) death!"
"Bahlee dad'niit!"
bahlee= all you + dad'na= death + -iit= suffix that turns the preceding term into an agentive noun - So, dad'niit= dead person (?) or simply dead
"All you dead people!" or a rendition that makes more sense in English: "Die all of you!"
"Dad'na eksa vijah." (eska is a typo)
dad'na= death + eks(a)= fix + vijah= life
"Death fixes/repairs life." or a couple, more elegant in nature, renditions: "Death mends life." or "Death restores life."
"Dad'na fifeh'rai!"
dad'na= death + fifeh'rai= quicken (Adara'hai uses this word when singing the Dusk Canticles).
"Quicken death!" or a rendition that makes more sense in English: "Die quickly!"
radhi/radhin: radhin= strong (we hear "Verkarth Do-Radhin hiicho" (Verkarth Strong-Warrior stand) in the Rithana-di-renada song[5], so radhi is likely to have a similar meaning, more likely strength, hence why I group the two words together.
"Ji'zho tsin'radhi!": doesn't have any relevance to the rite of Jhaz Ku-ji'zho, since it's heard when the player uses an ultimate skill in ESO, but ji'zho is very likely to have the same meaning in both phrases
ji'zho= memory (?) (ku-ji'zho= past memory (?)) + tsin= together (tsin'ra= all) + radhi= strength
"Remember/Recall all (your) strength!" is the closest rendition making sense in English that I can think of.
"Hiich radhin, tamiit!"
hiich(o)= stand (see the previous reference to the Rithana-di-renada song[5]) + radhin= strong + tamiit= partner
"Stand strong, partner!"
"Tsin radhin vabazeri."
tsin= together (tsin'ra= all) + radhin= strong + vabazeri= become
"Together (we) become strong(er)."
Radhin Zhab
radhin= strong + zhab= game
Strong Game
rajiit: Don't split compound words, unless you're certain what their components are. The word is tsin'rajiit.
"Bebaj tsin'rajiit."
beba(j)= praise + tsin'ra= all + -iit= suffix that turns the preceding term into an agentive noun - So, tsin'rajiit= all persons/everyone (?).
"Praise everyone/everything." or "Praise (it/them) all." (?)
  1. ^ a b c d e f g h i j k l m n o Zerith-var companion responses
  2. ^ Ravith-morna
  3. ^ Online:Thannar the Graveprowler
  4. ^ Rites of the Order of the Hidden Moon
  5. ^ a b c Song of Kingdoms
  6. ^ Rajhin's Shadow
  7. ^ a b Zerith-var Companion Dialog
  8. ^ a b c Strange Inscription(translation)
  9. ^ Viti's Notes: Song of Binding — High Cantor Viti
  10. ^ Zerith-var Quest Dialog
  11. ^ Rites of the Order of the Hidden Moon
  12. ^ Rites of the Order of the Hidden Moon
    13. Retrieved from "https://en.uesp.net/w/index.php?title=Lore_talk:Ta%27agra&oldid=3215977"